Title: Delivering Insights on the Energy Industry and Climate Impact: Kasim Khan ‘20

[00:00:06,280] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Welcome to Engineering Career Conversations. I'm Christa Downey, Director of the Engineering Career Center at Cornell University. 

[00:00:14,160] TRACI NATHANS-KELLY: And I'm Traci Nathans-Kelly, Director of the Engineering Communications Program. We are excited to bring you this forum where we will host lively conversations that we hope will inspire you. 

[00:00:25,660] CHRISTA DOWNEY: We're here today with Kasim Khan. Kasim is a research analyst at Wood Mackenzie, a global provider of data and analytic solutions for the renewable energy and natural resources industries. After graduating from Cornell Engineering in 2020, he began work at Woodmac, Supply Chain, doing consulting for utility, working to optimize supply chain operations across North America. His experience eventually led him to join the research team, where he now focuses on advising clients on energy storage technologies and operations. Welcome, Kasim. It's great to see it today. 

[00:01:01,075] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, good to see you. 

[00:01:02,710] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Thank you. So I'm excited to share your story with our listeners. And I'm hoping you can start by telling us a little bit about what you do in your current work, and then go into what does that look like on the, you know, day to day basis? 

[00:01:18,670] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, for sure. Yeah, currently I work as a research analyst for an energy economics and consulting firm called Wood Mackenzie or Woodmac, for short. And, essentially what we do. You know, I think I kind of view us as being, like a information aggregator, you know, both of quantitative and qualitative information, and we use that to develop our own research reports, pricing forecasts, other types of forecasts and really, like a independent third party expertise that we use to advise pretty much anyone in the energy industry about challenges, opportunities. I mean, this can be like advising renewable developers who are actually building battery storage projects, but it can also be like advising say, you know, like the Nigerian government on their oil and gas policy or something like that. Like, we work with a variety of players across the globe, and it's just very exciting to be in such a position where I can provide that, that sort of expert advice to different people. But yeah, so in terms of what that looks like on more of the day to day, I think a big part of my job is definitely speaking with people in the industry, so getting their perspective, hearing their thoughts, and then synthesizing all these different perspectives from different stakeholders into your own perspective on the market and then use that to develop thought leadership pieces. I'd say, yes, besides actually speaking to people and hopping on calls, a big part of it is working in Excel, PowerPoint typical tools I think a lot of analysts use, no matter which industry or which company you're working in. But I mean, certainly, those are, you know, some places where I spent a lot of my time to day to day working on, like, specific pricing models or developing reports for a pricing forecast. I'm talking price right now because I've been working on that this week, and that should be coming out in a few weeks. 

[00:03:25,550] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Yes. So if someone wants to get into this type of work, what might they consider doing as an undergraduate? 

[00:03:35,550] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, I mean, for this type of, like, market research role, I think you can really come from pretty much any background to be honest. I mean, the nice thing about this type of work is that though the organizations you work in and the people you work with come from a variety of backgrounds because it's really important to have that diverse perspective. So like myself, I used to be engineering, a lot of my colleagues also did engineering, of all types, you know, chemical, I was myself, and then I have other colleagues who did electrical, et cetera, but also people studying or who studied OR, people who had more of a policy background or maybe studied like pure mathematics, that sort of thing. Yeah, so really, I think, as long as there's, like, a demonstrated interest in the energy industry, and, you know, I think, as long as you also show potential for skills, like, skills that would be good in any job, you know, communication, teamwork, leadership, all those things are super important. 

[00:04:41,355] CHRISTA DOWNEY: What's one of the greatest challenges you've faced in your career? 

[00:04:44,650] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, good question. I think I would probably say the greatest challenge was this one specific project that I was on, not in my current role, but still at Woodmac, in my previous role in supply chain consulting. To give a little bit of context there, in supply chain consulting, we work mostly with utilities on specific project engagement, so like helping them renegotiate contracts, for example. Yeah, without going into too much detail, I'll say that I was maybe a couple of years into my career, and I was in charge of leading these negotiations with a few contracts that this one utility had with a slew of private equity firms. And these are people who obviously know their stuff. And that meant I really had to know my stuff. And it's not just that, right? It's not just giving a simple presentation, but it's actually, like, developing an argument. Actually sitting on a call and talking to these people and telling them information that they really don't want to hear, and they really don't like hearing. So, I mean, that was a huge challenge for me, right, especially, you know, coming from an engineering background where like, maybe some of those, like, more nuanced, you know, like organizational behavior, challenging questions, isn't it really something I dealt with a lot. But it's definitely an opportunity that I took to grow. I mean, I think I really overcame that by just like being as prepared as I could. So obviously developing my negotiation points, but then also, like, asking my colleagues for feedback, you know, holding, like mock calls before we actually did the real thing, as well as just like recording myself, hearing you know, hearing what I say correctly, what I say incorrectly, and better ways to phrase things. And, yeah, I mean, you know, I think it was definitely tough for the first couple of times, but I quickly became comfortable with it. And I think it really made me grow as a person. And I feel like after going through that, I feel like I can talk to pretty much anyone right now. 

[00:06:45,910] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Yes, thank you for sharing that. This is something that we all go through at some point in our lives and our careers. And I appreciate that students can hear that story that they're not the only ones who are struggling with this. Yeah. Thank you. 

[00:06:59,300] KASIM KHAN: Yeah. And I might also add just really quick, I feel like I think about this a lot, you know, because I feel like we hear a lot of these success stories of, like, really exceptional people who do amazing things in their 20s, right? And I'm sure a lot of a lot of highly motivated students at Cornell, elsewhere. You know, I mean, I myself was one of those definitely, we all want to shoot for the moon, right? And so with that is, like, you're probably going to be in rooms where you're going to be the youngest person there. So I think there is definitely always going to be some of that imposture syndrome. But I think maybe folks could turn that around and say, well, that actually means that I don't know, you're doing the right stuff. 

[00:07:36,220] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Yes. That's exactly right. I like that. I appreciate that perspective. So what inspired you to get into this line of work, and what is the impact you're hoping to make? 

[00:07:48,400] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, for sure. So what inspired me? I mean, pretty much as long as I can remember have been interested in climate, energy. I mean, you know, since I was a kid. Just reading about the issue of global warming and climate change was something that always, like, really stuck out to me as being this huge problem that we may or may not end up solving. I think at this point, I can probably say that we've made quite a bit of progress. So I'm actually, I'm sure some people might feel differently, but personally, I actually don't feel too bad or as bad about the situation as I did, maybe ten years ago. But, I mean, yeah, that's kind of been the main driver. So, like, that led me to studying back in high school, you know, for the science fair. I was looking at different types of battery technologies and battery research that were going on. I mean, this is kind of this is like 2013, 2014, when Tesla was beginning to getting some press coverage, still, you know, very early stage, like there weren't Teslas on the road in every other corner, like you see nowadays. But yes, that kind of prompted me to get into the battery EV battery storage space. And then when I was looking at colleges, it seemed like Cornell had a really great program for engineering, but also for the liberal arts, so I can get some more exposure to concepts beyond just the pure technology of things. So, that's really what I think drove me from like a background in chemical engineering, energy research at Cornell to something where I'd be able to also get a broader perspective of the actual industry, you know, beyond academia. So I mean, myself, you know, my senior year, I was kind of like really thinking between should I continue with the research and maybe do a PhD and really contribute to like the cutting edge of what's possible, with battery chemistry, or should I take this consulting offer that I had with Woodmac and actually figure out what are some of the other non technical challenges happening right now? So that's what I did. And I feel like I've learned a lot I've met some really amazing people. Yeah, ultimately, it just kind of led me to, you know, returning from the consulting work to something more research and more battery based, but not in the academic sense, in the market research sense. 

[00:10:08,360] CHRISTA DOWNEY: What ways do you anticipate AI impacting your work or this industry in general? 

[00:10:14,860] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Of course, AI is the thing everyone's talking about right now. Yeah, I mean, as a matter of fact, it's something that has been getting a lot of buzz, I think, in the energy community in the past past month, past couple of months here, as these different utilities, or grid operators across the country put out their forecasts for what they think their demand, like what they think their peak demand is going to look like ten, 20, 30 years from now, that number is really, really increasing year over year, and that's primarily due to data center growth, and the acceleration of that due to this boom we're seeing artificial intelligence. So you know, certainly from that perspective, it's like a lot of clients are asking us questions about how our data center is planning to meet that load growth. You know, obviously, these companies want to get to 100% renewable carbon free power. So some of that is definitely going to be delivered through storage, which is, you know, the research that I work on, specifically. But then, it's also going to be met by other things in the landscape. So I think a flip side to that is AI is also helping helping us accomplish the energy transition. Like, I think one area of technology that's really exciting right now are these things called virtual power plants. Now, I mean, these are things that I've been hearing about for quite a while now, but I think they're starting to get a pretty serious amount of attention these days and quite a bit of press. And so essentially, AI is really helpful here because it's really key in building these algorithms that can take you know, hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands plus of things like smart meters, electric vehicles, heat pumps that are scattered all across the region and figure out like the optimal dispatch strategies for each of those devices. And if you aggregate all of that, you can treat it as like a power plant that's the new virtual power plant. That's been really helpful because it's a really cost effective way for utilities to meet that demand growth without actually building, like a brand new solar plant or a brand new battery plant. So it's like both sides. You know, AI is causing this huge demand growth, but then we can also help meet it with AI as well. 

[00:12:47,410] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Yeah, so there are people with a variety of skill sets and interests who can get involved here. Students who are interested in data analytics, students who are interested in AI development, certainly, those who are civil engineers, chemical engineers, I mean, right, there's so many different angles where people can get involved in the work that you're doing. I'm curious to hear about the different types of people and companies and organizations that you are collaborating with on a regular basis. 

[00:13:17,590] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, different types of people, organizations, and companies. Well, that's the exciting thing about the job, I think is we get to work with a huge diverse set of players. So in terms of the people, I think pretty much anyone who's working in the energy space we interact with. So I mean, this can be very broad. I mean, these can be, you know, like policymakers, you know, people with insight into what policy is happening in Washington. That's super helpful for us right now, because, for those of you who don't know, the one huge huge boon for renewable energy in the past couple of years has been the Inflation Reduction Act passed in 2022, and there's still a lot of uncertainty as to how some of those benefits are going to translate. So, yeah, we speak to people who are in tune with that policy side, speak to people on the technology side. So like, what, you know, like engineers, like people actually doing engineering at different battery companies. They're super big to talk to on the sales side, business development, hearing what market opportunities different different players have and challenges they're facing. Yeah, and I kind of alluded this earlier, but in terms of, like, organizations, these can be governments, these can be banks, financial institutions, who are lending money to renewable energy projects. These can be actual developers, so people who are actually building the project, they can be OEMs, original equipment manufacturers that are actually building the tech that is getting deployed here, and, yeah, it could be think tanks, non profits, as well, et cetera, et cetera. 

[00:14:48,865] CHRISTA DOWNEY: What do you wish you knew when you were a sophomore? 

[00:14:51,320] KASIM KHAN: What I wish I had known as a sophomore is, I think, really being able to appreciate the networking opportunities I had in undergrad. And I honestly don't think I really understood the meaning of networking until, like, shortly before I graduated or maybe even after I graduated. So yeah, for those sophomores or freshmen who might be listening to the podcast, I don't mean networking opportunities as in, like, attending networking events and schmoozing with people. Although that's part of it. I'm not going to say don't do that, but I think a lot of it really just comes from, like, being aware that you're in this awesome place surrounded by, like by people. I mean, you all had to apply and get in and get accepted. So it's just like an extraordinary environment to learn from so many different types of people who will all go on to do great things. And, you know, like, both from a professional and social perspective, I think it's super important to just, like, pass on, you know, like, make as many connections as you can, join clubs. Yeah, just, like, really stay in touch with people. You know, I mean, I'm not going to say it's like, impossible after college, but it definitely gets a little harder. I mean, I'm thankful that in the consulting role I had, I was able to meet a lot of people, you know, kind of my age with similar interests. But you're not going to find that everywhere. So yeah, definitely seize that opportunity, while you have it. 

[00:16:20,890] CHRISTA DOWNEY: So along those lines, what classes had the greatest impact in preparing you for your career? 

[00:16:26,675] KASIM KHAN: I mean, there are a few I could pick from. I think what's probably been most helpful was my experience in the intro, not intro to CHEME class, but it was CHEME 2190, ENGRD 2190. This is the class that all sophomore CHEMEs take before they, you know, actually get into the major. I had a great professor. I hope he still teaches this course. I'm actually not sure, but Professor Duncan. He, I think, taught me a lot about, like, how to think about problems creatively, as well as how to do creative research and present information in new ways. That makes it intuitive for the reader to understand what you're saying. I mean, that's super helpful in the work that I do because I'm always trying to think of ways we can use data to tell stories, and a lot of our clients come to us with questions. Sometimes it can be really hard to answer that if you don't have a structured way of thinking about it. So yeah, just like those ways of problem solving and thinking about how to analyze and present data has been has been super helpful. 

[00:17:29,400] CHRISTA DOWNEY: What do you do to relax and re energize and have fun? 

[00:17:32,705] KASIM KHAN: Well, I think music's my biggest thing. I love, love, love to play music and listen to music as well, of course. So I've been doing French Horn for a long time. Yeah, you know, middle school, high school, then I was in the symphony orchestra in college. And and Boston's great, so I'm based in Boston. And it's a great place for finding community groups to play in. I'm actually playing in a concert in about a week. So that's pretty exciting. Definitely a great way to, you know, meet people and just kind of a, take my mind off work. And then also play some guitar on the side as well and jam with some friends in the city. And then, yeah, beyond that, you know, I like playing tennis, you know, board games with friends and all that. Fun stuff. 

[00:18:16,540] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Is there any place you want people to follow you to see where you're playing? 

[00:18:20,045] KASIM KHAN: Oh, to see me playing. I don't know about that, but if you want to if you want to follow me in my socials, I'm happy to say, you can find me @kawesomekhan on Twitter.  K Awesome Khan. 

[00:18:37,350] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Okay. Excellent. Excellent. Okay. So speaking of social, where do you go to stay current on information for your field of work? 

[00:18:48,290] KASIM KHAN: I think Twitter X is actually kind of underrated, still. Like, I mean, yeah, like ignoring all the drama that's kind of happened in the past, like, a year and a half, but still it's like, interesting, you know? Like, you'd think after everyone sort of, I mean, not boycotting, but kind of wanting to leave the platform after Elon Musk bought it. It's like you'd think there would be something else that people are on now, but really not really. Like, I've spoken with people who are like thought leaders in the industry as well, and they've kind of told me that LinkedIn, Twitter is pretty much the place to be. And I like it a lot because I mean, if you keep it to a professional level, I think it could be quite informative. It's just a great way to hear directly from smart people. I mean, like, you'll have a lot of professors doing really insightful research, and you can tweet them and asked them questions, or see, like, back and forth discourse between different academics or different people who work in industry. It's like a really great way to see, like what is trending right now in energy. 

[00:19:50,780] CHRISTA DOWNEY: So if you were not doing this work right now, what might you be doing? 

[00:19:54,920] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, if I was not doing this. I mean, is this kind of like a dream job question? 

[00:20:01,395] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Maybe. Maybe. Whatever you want it to be? 

[00:20:04,310] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, I mean, I don't know. I do love music a lot. I feel like if I, yeah, you know, if like, money were no object, I suppose. I probably would be doing that in some sense. You know, I mean, it would probably be more on the rock or pop side or indie side than classical or French Horn. I mean, I love the French Horn, but I just I just don't think I could do classical music for the rest of my life. 

[00:20:28,410] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Who knows? Who knows? Maybe some thing will come out of that. Fantastic. Is there anything else you'd like to share with our audience? 

[00:20:37,375] KASIM KHAN: I mean, I guess there are a few things. I think I mentioned this, I mentioned this in the beginning. But in terms of the progress we're making on the energy transition, I think it's actually been pretty significant the past few years. Let's see, like, I mean, in 2018, policies had us on track for about 3.1 to 3.7 degrees Celsius of warming by 2100, and that's above pre industrial levels. And now that's down to 2.5 to 2.9. So, I mean, within six years or something, that's gone down a pretty significant amount. And so I think some of those success stories, you know, don't get talked about as much. I think it's important to recognize that a ton of progress has been made. I mean, granted, you know, those are still just projections, so we need people to actually make those a reality. And obviously 2.5 to 2.9 is still very bad. You know, anything anything above zero, I mean, really is not good. But yeah, so it's like we made good progress, but yeah, we've got to keep fighting the good fight. And then, you know, I guess, the other thing from like a more career advice perspective, I would really encourage, like, reaching out to alumni and people who work in the industry because as an undergrad, like, I really didn't know about the opportunities to get involved in renewable energy. Like, these weren't really companies that came up in class discussions. So I think without doing the right outreach, you're not really going to know what's out there. And then maybe a third thing is something that I wish I had maybe done a little bit more is just, like, kind of trust my instinct and not like overthink things too much, because I don't know, kind of, like, what I've found personally is, like, my instinctual decisions have usually been right. Like, you don't need a reason for everything. I feel like a lot of a lot of engineers want to know why like they're doing every single thing. I mean, just like natural curiosity, right. But I think to some degree, you don't need to know why, you can just do things because you want to do it. 

[00:22:39,580] CHRISTA DOWNEY: I like that. Good. I appreciate your positive outlook towards the future. It gives me hope because, yeah, I was seeing it less hopeful than you're portraying it. So I appreciate that. 

[00:22:53,520] KASIM KHAN: It definitely comes and goes. Depending on the latest headlines, yeah. 

[00:22:57,460] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Awesome. I've greatly appreciated learning more about the work that you're doing, and again, your insight into where we're headed. So thank you so much for chatting, and we will talk again soon. 

[00:23:11,800] KASIM KHAN: Yeah, thanks. It was a pleasure chatting. 

[00:23:19,490] CHRISTA DOWNEY: Thank you for listening. If you are enjoying these conversations, please follow, rate, and review on your favorite platform. Join us for the next episode, where we will be celebrating excellence and innovation among engineers whose impact contributes to a healthier, more equitable, and more sustainable world.